A few additions regarding my taliban post of yesterday

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By Oliver AKA The Admin on 32 comments
in Categories: Just Talking
Tags: tentacles

I wrote a few additions regarding my taliban post of yesterday. They were inspired from various sources, Sankakucomplex, ANN, and various other sources.

It’s a wall of text, don’t force yourself to read if you already didn’t care about yesterday’s post.

– This text was pushed by “hard right wing intolerant old conservatives are pussies” Shintaro Ishihara, current Tokyo Governor, who has a high local popularity, and doesn’t give a fuck about protestations (on the contrary, that’s the kind of guy who loves them, so that he can have someone to whom to give the finger). Don’t expect cowardly political leaders ready to give up after a few protestations.

– This technically should only affects sales in Tokyo, but Tokyo is the heart of Japan, both on the creation (investment) side, and on the audience (sales) side, avoiding tokyo is not an option.

– Despite the looks, hentai and non-hentai mangas are a relatively fragile market. There are not only the super huge stars, for instance my beloved Naomi Nekomata had recently told she was not earning heaps of cash, just barely enough. This market is hugely relying on tankoubon sales (reminder : tank, mags, the ecosystem). So if the future becomes incertain (risk to have to stop publication, or risk not to be able to do reprints), most publishers will think twice before allowing a serie to start or to continue

– Being thrown to and forced to stay in the 18+ corner is a death penalty for anything not initially sold as hentai, it would mean being removed from “for teenagers” weekly magazines, and losing exposure and sales.

– Even in the 18+ corner, the blow is heavy : some themes are becoming technically very risky (no more characters in uniform or on school grounds, for instance ?!?, FFS), several niches have no way out (Futa ? Boy’s Love ? Incest ? Ew, unnatural youth perverting gross shit ! Let’s not mention rape, loli and tentacles, right ?)…

– If you’re a pure “vanilla between adults” fan, you’re also concerned, the manga publishing industry is a whole, if several stratas of the market are affected, then the whole market is in pain, and in the end there will be much less creativity and creations

– What I don’t know : if the shit is definitive or not (must it still be validated at various points, can it be blocked at other various points), how widely the plan is to be applied and respected, and if the whole of Japan (save the publishers already rising up against the text without success) even gives a fuck.

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heru
heru
13 years ago

So, your conclusion is … ???

Shalva_sf
Shalva_sf
13 years ago
Reply to  heru

Unless the old fart gets a kick in the ass the manga industry (as well as anime) is doomed

clockworkice
clockworkice
13 years ago

Hopefully it still needs more approval, I read the post from yesterday and noticed it mentioned that after another voting it would be signed. I'm sure i'm not just speaking for myself when i say there goes alot of great mangas aside from the hentai. Such a sad day that will be.

Squally
Squally
13 years ago

I don't see what everyone is so worried about. I highly doubt something like this will go though and I doubt that everyday mangas will be effected much. But we'll see, it's not the first time something like thsi has happened.

Shalva_sf
Shalva_sf
13 years ago
Reply to  Squally

Considering the vague wording of the law pretty much any manga that involves any hint of violence can be banned. The whole idea of "protecting the youth" usually goes with huge restrictions of freedoms. Just see what happened to George Carlin and his "7 words you can't say on the radio" and what happened to radio in US in general.

Fran
Fran
13 years ago

If it passes.. then we'll be fucked, but not just fucked; We'll be Elephant-dick-pounded-in-the-ass-no-reach-around-jungle fucked.
Chances are that it'll be blocked at some point but who knows.

Carrot_Glace
Carrot_Glace
13 years ago

In the short term, hentai would not be affected, TV anime and manga will be. In long term, this would be a total disaster for this unique media form we call "japanese manga/anime".
The reason behind this law is more deep than we can see in a first glance: this is a full-throttle attack against otaku subculture, that represent individualism and irresponsibility to those old geezers (grown ups must not read manga!).

Qwerty
Qwerty
13 years ago

Has anyone thought of how exactly this ban will be enforced?

The Tokyo government has no ability to actually ban anything from what I have read. At the most if they find something that has been published/aired as objectionable they will file a complaint with the producing company and after 12 complaints within a year they have the option of reporting the company to that industries self regulatory board. If the industry itself is against the ban would their regulatory board really do anything?

I mean if it's like in the US where you have the government giving companies self regulation power over the amount of toxic chemicals in their products we've had incidents where companies have been found to have massive amounts of toxic chemicals in their childrens products but are able to wave it off by claiming the products are meant for adults.

The Oracle
The Oracle
13 years ago
Reply to  Qwerty

Not to mention a probable case for judicial review by the Supreme Court from aformentioned publishers.

The law will probably be enforced, though, and it is a huge blow on anime, specifically (TV Tokyo is a major anime network, and a metropolitan television). Would the ordinance affect too much the market, which is now a strategic asset for Japan (not so much economically than politically, soft power and all…), that I suspect it would be repelled. Nagoya or Osaka might harbour publishers, though, just like after the war.

Shalva_sf
Shalva_sf
13 years ago
Reply to  Qwerty

Considering that some publishers ALREADY (before the banned is actually in power) start kicking out some manga out of the publications…

Gutts
Gutts
13 years ago

I read up on this yesterday as well. It’s sad that it passed but another reason it passed was simply because no one believed it would pass, ironic? Sankaku kept reporting about the bill and all the comments were basically people laughing at it and making jokes. No one took it seriously and now that it has passed very few people seem to understand the implications.

Sure, this bill only affects Tokyo right now, which is the focal point of the targeted industry. Yet, let’s not forget that what happens once can happen twice. More politicians like Ishihara emboldened by the passing of this bill will try and pass similar bills in other prefectures.

What is worse is the fact that Japan’s economy could be said to be at a standstill or worse. When their economy is in trouble they’re going to crush a steady stream of income? I don’t see how this makes sense. Because of Ishihara Japan’s decline in the World has been cemented. This will basically mean the collapse of many Japanese companies and most likely very few manga to read, if any at all. As I see it there isn’t much we can do but I hope that those in Japan will make a solid stand for their rights.

Oh and as a worst case scenario and a prediction of mine I’d just like to point one thing out. If Japan loses power and China becomes one of the biggest powers in the world, I can see China making an excuse to attack Japan. It’s unlikely this would happen but for some reason I see this happening.

Giant3n3myCrab
Giant3n3myCrab
13 years ago

Japan to stop being perverts?! Preposterous :D! Seriously though, I doubt this will be passed, though not for any reasons regarding those personal freedoms a lot of government officials find so bothersome. I simply doubt Japan's leaders are stupid to pass a law that would negatively impact the economy, however slightly.

Then again, I also learned to never underestimate the idiocy of politicians.

entropy13
entropy13
13 years ago

According to Sankaku, it has been signed into law now. http://www.sankakucomplex.com/2010/12/15/tokyo-ma

It has passed the committee vote, and just earlier, passed the final vote.

Shogun
Shogun
13 years ago

I must make a note that these "adults" really forgot what they grew up on.

Unless they grew up being forced by their parents to work on paddy fields or had a really drunk father or mother bashing their heads with salmons, I doubt they themselves had never bought a magazine or even read one.

What was the target audience of hentai? Adults. What is the target audience of ecchi manga? Adults. What really corrupts the mind of teenagers? Lousy education. Why focus on the weak perfume while the shit is still pilling there?

I guess the government EVERYWHERE are filled with dumbfucks =="

EDIT: and I also guess that government EVERYWHERE want to make the world boring, uneventful and uniform. So that they can govern a bunch of retards.

Shalva_sf
Shalva_sf
13 years ago
Reply to  Shogun

I simply LOVE the idea that the old fart who pushed that ban actually writes his own porn novels, which are, by the way, are not banned. So I guess he's just trying to create more audience for himself. I freaking hate hypocrites

BlahBlahBlah
BlahBlahBlah
13 years ago

Actually, this bill will have zero effect on 18+ manga. All it does is broaden the scope of things that would fall in that category. It doesn’t outright ban anything. You’re loli and rape porn is safe, its things like non-porn homosexual and student/teacher romance that is in danger.

See this article and other posts in the same blog for details:
http://dankanemitsu.wordpress.com/2010/12/14/something-people-overseas-can-do-fight-misconceptions-about-bill-156-and-japan/

Qwerty
Qwerty
13 years ago

Even if the Bill has been signed into law I can't see it lasting very long. With the TAF already dying and Comiket likely not surviving in any previous form this is going to be a huge hit to the local economy. Unless all of those massive crowds at comiket are locals they need places to sleep/eat while they're there and that means big money for local businesses.

Speaking of Comiket does anyone have an idea of how many individual works are sold at each event? If there is supposed to be a committee reviewing every printed work sold in the city they could simply overwhelm them.

Qwerty
Qwerty
13 years ago

I really hate that Sankaku seems to be a primary source of information on this subject. Every site I go to seems to link to sankaku as their source at some point. The entire site is nothing but comments singing gloom and doom assuming the entire manga/anime industry is just going to close down at this point and do nothing.

I know next to squat about Japanese politics or law but I would assume these companies have at least one lawyer at their disposal to fight this stuff.

Shalva_sf
Shalva_sf
13 years ago
Reply to  Qwerty

Well, they probably have lawyers but considering the Japanese legal system is pretty poor (98% conviction with police beating out confessions and usual tendency of sweeping under the rug) I doubt publishers stand a chance

threetwo
13 years ago

the problem is if it widen the scope of 18+ material a lot of border the line manga like "To Love Ru" will now be placed under 18+ material section and of course will reduce their sell. This in turn will make the industry think twice when they want to publish ecchi stuff. Think of this bill as the California Adult Game regulation bill. It doesn't outright ban anything but just widen the scope of adult material can hugely affect the industry.

entropy13
entropy13
13 years ago

Naruto would now be 18+ for depiction of violence and depiction of children as "violent"….lol

No depictions of school uniforms and school locations…

Gumby
Gumby
13 years ago

The ban explicitly doesn't affect anything rated R-18 or anything self published, so our porn is safe at least. Now, as for fans of series like Berserk, Vinlad Saga, or Nana to Kaoru… Well. Damn.

Unfortunately, in Japan, for something to obtain R-18 ratings it must be pornography, no exceptions. So they can't just bump up the rating to keep selling.

FORTUNATELY, pretty much every major publisher is boycotting this years Tokyo Animation Festival, along with DISNEY in protest, and that's gotten the PM involved because that's a fuckton of money they're losing if that happens.

threetwo
13 years ago
Reply to  Gumby

All of the series you list are already on somekind of seinen magazine. I don't know about Japan regulation but I suppose they are already in the adult side of the bookstore. So They will also will not be affected by this bill. But If I am wrong than we are seriously screwed.

About the boycotting. So far It seem ineffective because the chief backer of the bill is still unaffected by their decision. We need more grassroot movement or some really big US interest group to jump in and do something here.

Qwerty
Qwerty
13 years ago

"Naruto would now be 18+ for depiction of violence and depiction of children as "violent"….lol "

I'm REALLY interested to see how this thing effects stuff like Naruto. The current series aside just look at the original. You have children that are what, 13? Fighting each other, fighting adults who are intent on killing them, you have kids dying, kids being told that their death or their friends deaths are less important than their duties.

Stormbow1527
Stormbow1527
13 years ago

I don't know why you seem to be downplaying rape and loli depictions as if they aren't harmful. I guess you've never been on the receiving end of rape or of child molestation…

If the bill is going to regulate Naruto, then it truly is a bit over the top~! But preventing young boys from being normalized to the idea of raping young girls is a healthy move. I'm sorry if you don't understand how horrible being raped is…

Itsit
Itsit
13 years ago

I never held a gun in my hand, but I practiced archery for a while. A bow is heavy, the recoil is strong even in low-powered bows (olympic recurve bow, not crossbow), and I was told that the recoil of a firearm ir even stronger. Shooting a gun is WAY different than playing a FPS, anybody will notice at least after the first shot (I guess if not held properly the gun will go flying or something)

Similarily, having actual sex is VERY different from masturbating. Hell, having sex is awkward enough the first time when it's consentual, imagine when it's not…

My point being: depictions of bad stuff can be bad and stuff (sorry for being redundant), but the gap between depiction and the actual thing is really big, so I don't think that just depictions should be regulated so harshly.

Shalva_sf
Shalva_sf
13 years ago
Reply to  Stormbow1527

Ha ha ha. I guess all who play Black Ops are SURE to become cold-blooded killers. And all us who grew up playing "DOOM" are just closeted psycho maniacs just waiting to unleash our rocket-launcher rage on society…

Shalva_sf
Shalva_sf
13 years ago

Just finished episode 57 of FMA Brotherhood. By the new law this show is soooo banned!!! Are you kidding me, with all the bloodshed and brutality the psyche of little feeble kiddies is gonna snap and they either gonna turn into neets and hikimori, or snap into another direction and start eating their pets then progressing to neighbors. Therefore the almighty and wise fathers of Japan gonna BAN THAT Abomination and then publicly burn all the DVDs and Mangas!!! The more I think about this law the less sense it makes

Marcus
Marcus
13 years ago

Just to clarify, I am right wing, and I enjoy hentai as much as the next guy on here. That irredeemable lousy excuse for a human being that is the Tokyo Governer is not right wing or left wing, he's just a self serving dick. Don't bring polotics into a matter that is just about greed and spite. Thats the only reason he is doing this.

Name?
Name?
13 years ago

"
This is injustice for all,
There about to ban Culture…

Manga is a cultural development back in the days (So much history), where it was used to exaggerate the emotions and to lighten the mood, I do not see any harm in that.
Manga is the same industry as in the good old American Comic books.

Manga & Anime in Japan = $$$
Comics & Cartoons in America = $$$

Where's the so called truth about manga affecting the health of Kids? Was it proven scientifically or did some one simply woke up one morning and said, "O I think I'll Ban Manga!"

Where's all the Supporting Fans of Manga, Artist, Producers? Why do u guys simply sit there doing nothing? U guys need to stand up to your rights and freedom of self expression, and Explain why, Why! this is unacceptable.

Any one In Japan, needs to understand if this goes threw, you basically lost what makes Japan the Best, Where not talking about Manga, but cultural expression, you guys are going to lose one giant chunk of What makes Japan, and its citizens.

You can't Ban Manga, the American Comics and the Manga are the same, it has all the same genre so why is one worst then the other?

Don't simply Say, Do something
"

shengy
shengy
13 years ago

So initially hentai had something relevant to a scenario and doesn't just go to sex directly. Now they're fucked. e.g. from 'Touch and Go' <a href="http://(http://www.hentairules.net/2010/10/30/touch-and-go-english-by-mozuya-murasaki/)..” target=”_blank”>(http://www.hentairules.net/2010/10/30/touch-and-go-english-by-mozuya-murasaki/)... It starts with school girl+groping that eventually leads to vanilla sex. Ban the school and uniform theme and ban the groping "sexual act" and you got a 'Touch and Go' version that's basically a boy and a girl naked, and having sex in a building. FFFFUUCK!

EDIT: Start saving your favourite loli, incest and whatnot on your HDD